kigoobe
kigoobe
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Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ???
«on:
05/13/05 at 19:02:47 » |
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Never even in my wildest dream I could think that Sylheti could be a seperate language, and not merely a Bangla dialect - till I came across a post from admin a few days before. After going through some websites since then this is getting stronger in my mind, that Sylheti, in fact, was a distinct language with its own alphabet, and which is getting merged into Bangla slowly and slowly, loosing all its identity, specially in India.
What do you think friends ? |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 07:29:09 » |
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Janmer por theke shishu taar mayer mukh theke je bhasha shune aashe, sei bhashai sei shishur matri-bhasha. Se sahaj saral anchalik katya bhasha'i houk othoba samridda-shali byakaran bishuddho dhwani chapol alankrika bhasha'i houk.
Sylhet totha brihattor Sylhete je shishu janmo grahon kore, sabhabik bhabei sei shishur kane Sylheti shabdo dhwanito hobe. Kintu ei Sylheti ekti bhasha na upobhasha? Ekti upobhasha tokhoni ekti bhashate rupantorito hoy jokhon sei bhashar haraf, byakaranadi bibhinno goon lokkon kora jaay ebong geet, sangeet adi sahitya rachanar madhome sei luko-bhashake prakrito bhashar roop deya jaay.
Kono nirdishto katya-bhashar pratishtito jana-gosthi tader katya-bhashay kotha bole kintu jodi sei katya-bhashar byakaran ba sahitya na thake ta hole sei katya-bhashake sampurna bhasha bola jaay na. Abar kono bhashar jodi byakaran ebong sahitya samridho thake, kintu sei bhasha jodi kono jono-goshthir kathya-bhasha ba matri-bhasha na o hoy, tobu o sei bhasha ke sampurna bhasha bola jaay - jemon Sanskrit ba Latin.
Je kono bhasha sudrida bhabe pratistita hote hole prothamei proyojon jono-sampod. Saubhagya-krame Bangladesh, Bharat, Juktarajyo, Madhya-Prachya, tatha prithibir bibhinno deshe choriye aache 12 million er adhik Sylheti ra ebong tara Sylheti tei kotha bolen.
Ei Sylheti bhasha ati prachin ebong onanyo bhashar moto "shruti" hoye prothome lookmukhe prachar chilo. Jodio ei bhashar ekhono o sathik itihas khunje paoya jaay ni kintu bhasha-bidh ra mone koren je aatsho (800) bochorer o purbe ei bhasha jana-sadharoner moddhe prochar chilo. Karon onek bhasha-bidh der biswas je Hajrat Shah-Jalal 1303 khistabde Sylhet aakramon koren ebong Sylheter anchalik bhashatei tini Islam dharma prochar korte cheshta korechilen. Taai dharma procharer sarthe prothom Sylheti haraf tairi kora hoy ja Biharer Kaithi harafer anurup chilo. Poroborti kale Sylheti haraf e Bangla ebong Devnagri haraf er probhab dekha jaay.
Je hetu ei haraf Islam dharma procharer jonno byborito hoyechilo, se hetu Sylhet er Musalmaan der moddhe ei roop nagorakshar procholito chilo ebong onek Musalmani "ketab" ba "punthi" ei akkhore lekha hoy. Ei akkhor khub sohojei shikkha kora jeto ebong Islam dharmer sathe sathe ei nagorakkhorer procholon o dekha diyechilo.
Samay er sathe sathe onek mulya baan kitab hariye geche kintu ekhon o "Siloti Nagori" haraf e rachito pandulipi ebong mudrito boi paoya jacche ja aaraisho (250) bochorer o purono.
Adhikangsha punthi i Oislamik itihas janak ba dhama puran. Arabic ebong Parsi shobde alangkrito hoyeche ei sob kitaber prishtaguli.
Unobingsha shatabdir moddho bhag porjonto ei sob kitab guli hastalipi tei leka hoto. Kintu 1860 saale Maulavi Abdul Karim Europe theke mudran shilper gyan arjan kore 1870 saale pratham Sylhet shohore "Islamia Press" kholen ebong "Sylhet Nagori" lipi te onek boi mudran koren. Dhire dhire Sunamgunj ebong Shillong e dhatu paater mudran shilpo khola hoy. Emon ki sudur Kolkatay tin ti mudran kendra khula hoy ebong eder ek ti stapito kora hoyechilo 16, Gardener Lane, Taaltala, Calcutta.
1947 saaler Purba Pakistaner sathe Sylhet er sanyoger sathei ei sob brihot sahitya atimatray abahelito hote laaglo ebong onek mulyo baan pustak lupto hoye gelo. Dhire dhire sob mudran kendra stagito hote laaglo ebong obosheshe 1970 saale "Sylhet Nagori" bhashar shesh mudran kendra bondho hoye gelo. 1971 er Mukti-juddho er somoye Sylheter Islamiya Press agni kande dhawngsa hoy.
Bortomaan kaale Juktorajye bosobaskari koyek jon Sylheti ra osadharon porisram kore Sylheti bhashar punoruddhar korechen. Star Publishers 1997 saale asol "Sylhet Nagorakkhor" boidyotik matray nirikkhon kore sadharon computer font tairi koreche ja "New Surma" haraf naame procholito hocche. Hariye jaoya koyekti boi tara punorooddhar kore adhunik mudra-jantra dwara prokash koreche.
Juktarajye prokashito onek Bangla sangbad-potre koyek prishtha Bangla horofe Sylheti bhashay khobor procharito hoy. Sylheti jonogoshti oddohshito elakay dwi-bhashik Bangali shikkhok/shikkhika der Sylheti bhashay kotha bola aboshyok - eta chakurir dorkasto potrei aaj kaal lekha thake.
khorosruta Saraswati nadir moto hariye giyechilo Sylheti bhasha kintu dhire dhire punorjagorito hocche ei bhasha bidhesher matite!
iti
Bijli :)
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i_am_amnesiac
i_am_amnesiac
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 13:16:08 » |
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Sourav, u have started a good topic. Bijli, thanks for the nice and well documented answer. Sometimes I wonder, where do u get the time to go thru all these info.
My personal opinion, after speaking to some of the historians, is that sylheti was indeed a seperate language. It even had a script of its own. As time elapsed gradually sylheti became another dialect of bengali. |
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kigoobe
kigoobe
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 16:15:52 » |
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Ko chain ba Shovon, dukkho lage na ni ba mone :-[ :'(
Great documentation Bijli |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 16:18:21 » |
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Thank you shovon. :)
Well, I guess I’m pretty busy but when I saw this interesting topic, I had to take some time out and do some research. Fortunately, I know some people here in London who are doing some research on Sylheti language (or dialect!). I also have some good collection of books inherited form my family which are extremely informative but above all the people who are living here in UK who left Bangladesh for political and many reasons are the direct source of my research.
I can recommend you 2 books which I found extremely interesting and gives a crystal clear idea about the history of Sylhet. Both books are now nearly 100 years old so its not about the modern history of Sylhet. Let me know if you can find it.
iti Bijli :)
Srihatter Itibritta
Shihatter Purbangsha
Both books are written by Achyut Charan Chawdhury (Tatvanidhi)
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kigoobe
kigoobe
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 16:20:47 » |
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Srihatter itibritto boita ami aaij prai 15 bochor dhori khujairam (jokhon thaki sunchi amrar bonsher uleekh ache i boio) ... duita boi-i ami faite agrohi Bijli ... kuno upai jana ache ki ? |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 16:33:54 » |
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Amaro ma r bongsho dhorder naam aar talika deoya aache boite. budhoy shei jonnoi amar dadu e boi ta kinchila.
parano mudran aaij kail paoya khub mushkil kintu ami jani Dhaka r ek prokashok notun bhabe mudran korche ei dui boi. sathik bhabe janiya tumare janaimu. |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 16:36:45 » |
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london e koyek ta boro bangla boi er dukan aache. ami somoy kori khujiya tumare janaimu. amar friend ra nishchoi janbo boi tain koi paoya jaaibo. :) |
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kigoobe
kigoobe
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 16:50:00 » |
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That would be be great Bijli. Aar tumar Dhakaiya prokashok-er naam ta faileo bakka bhala hoibo. (For the simple reason that we can purchase the same book at a much cheaper price) 1 Pound = koto teka bangladeshi aaijkaail ??? 80 / 90 hoibo nani ? |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 17:19:06 » |
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:) Tumar Euro e koto teka hoy jani na
kintu £1 = 80 Rupi
£1 = 116 Taka :o
ei rokom dor choler mone hoy market o |
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Debajit
Debajit
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 17:37:44 » |
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Boi tain khujaar moto eto ta somoy (agroho?) pairaam na, kintu Bijli ba kigoobe, if u can give me some web links, i SHALL BE HAPPY to go thru the itihaash.
kichhu thakle pathaiyo - ogrim dhonyobaad. |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/18/05 at 22:47:22 » |
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Hi Debajit,
Have a look at this site. Don't forget to scrol down to the bottom of the page where you will have more options to research on "Siloti Nagri".
Let me know what you think.
Bijli :)
http://www.sylheti.org.uk/ |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/20/05 at 13:56:33 » |
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Dear Saurav da,
Here are the details of the book that you were looking for long time.
Srihatter Itibritta (Purvangsho)
Srihatter Itibritta (Uttarangsho)
A history of Sylhet by Achyut Charan Choudhury Tatvanidhi.
First Edition - 1910.
Reprint - 2002.
Published by - Mustafa Salim, Uthsa Prokashan
127 Aziz Super Market, 2nd Floor, Shabag, Dhaka-1000.
Phone number: 011834459
Price: 350 Taka
15 US$
ISBN- 984-889-000-9 |
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aami-S
aami-S
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/23/05 at 20:02:48 » |
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Great knowledge KA KHAAZAANA...
thanks...ddbhi ...specially..bijili. ;D.I too heard of these books....
Also...i would like to get a glance in to your running thesis on the subject related to the aforesaid topic. ...(even if its not completed....can u mail me how to get it....
I beleive in ur potetial as a writer and explorer..thats why i wanna go through ur documents...
ami-S |
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kigoobe
kigoobe
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/27/05 at 20:08:18 » |
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Thanks for the wonderful staff Bijli ... I will try getting it somehow ... couldn't get their publication house thro' search though ... :-/ .... anyway, thanks a lot ... I will try contacting them ... |
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kigoobe
kigoobe
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/27/05 at 20:18:52 » |
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Phone korlam tarare, koy 'apni bhul numbere dial korechen' ... monehoi number ta thik na .. google mariya dekhlam dhakar number suru hoi 7,8 ba 9 diya ... 0 diya to kichcu suru hoi na ... besides, I have tried 00 880 2 then ur number 01 etc.... is there any mistake from my part ?
Lastmesh google-e try korlam - Achyut Charan Choudhury Tatvanidhi - bhablam kichu jodi pai .. and guess what ? Na, tumi try koriya dekho kita pao ...
Tx |
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brown_eyes
brown_eyes
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/27/05 at 21:08:23 » |
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[quote author=kigoobe link=board=0011&num=1115983967&start=15#15 date=05/27/05 at 20:18:52]
Lastmesh google-e try korlam - Achyut Charan Choudhury Tatvanidhi - bhablam kichu jodi pai .. and guess what ? Na, tumi try koriya dekho kita pao ...
Tx
[/quote]
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/30/05 at 18:56:32 » |
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Brown eye, oto kene hashlay koilay na je. :)
Saurav,
ami boir majhe je number paichlam otau tumare koilam. anyway, london thaki ami ek dukano khuj kori ei boi paichi. tarar kache dui boi aache. du o boir daam hoilo £18. niche dukanor thikana aar address dilam. tara Paris boi pathaito parbo. dukanor malik siloti. siloti te moto jodi bhala paibo.
Mira U.K.
57, Fashion Street
London
E1 6P6
Tel: 00 44 207 377 6688
Tarar kache Rajnogorer Itihash namok arekta khub bhala boi aache. itar daam £15-20.
tumi dukano sorasori jujajug korio. jodi kuno osubidha hoy te ami boi kiniya tumare pathaimu ne.
janaio if it was a success this time.
Bijli :) |
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asiti
asiti
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/30/05 at 19:07:44 » |
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[quote author=kigoobe link=board=0011&num=1115983967&start=15#15 date=05/27/05 at 20:18:52]
Lastmesh google-e try korlam - Achyut Charan Choudhury Tatvanidhi - bhablam kichu jodi pai .. and guess what ? Na, tumi try koriya dekho kita pao ...
Tx
[/quote]
Ita Google er [B]Googly[/B] re ba ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Ami tumar kotha moto try koria dekhlam.... ;D ;D ;D ;D |
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/30/05 at 20:15:35 » |
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Brown eye, tumar hashir ortho ekhon ami bujhchi. ami ou matro google e gelam. ;D ;D ;D
saurav, great work. :D :D :D
Bijli
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kigoobe
kigoobe
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
05/31/05 at 04:57:52 » |
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Thanks a lot Bijli. I appreciate sincerely your help.
I will try this address tomorrow.
Tx again. |
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didibhai
Kavita_Gupta
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
06/07/05 at 08:20:25 » |
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Bijili,
nice to hear that you are in the UK. I live here also. I am actually writing a thesis on the partition of India with a special focus on Sylheti Hindus. I was looking for the books myself. I wonder if you know of Lloyd Wiliams from SOAS, he lives in the Bethnal Green area, he sent me a new edition of 'Sylheter Itibritto' in English. I am looking to buy this book also, but the original books would be very helpful. Are they available in English? as I cannot read Bengali that well. It seems from the postings that we may be involved in something similar, perhaps you can fill me in what you are exactly doing, it may be beneficial for both of us. I will try the information you provided and also I have some distant relatives in Dhaka I may ask them to look for the publisher you mentioned.
Thanks
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Bijili
Bijili
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
06/12/05 at 16:53:46 » |
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Dear Didibhai,
so nice to know that you are writing your thesis on the subjuct of pertition on with special focus on sylheti hindus. i'm a fashion designer and work in a company and own my own company as well. i keep interests in languages specially in bengali and in sanskrit but its only an interest. i haven't done any higher lavel of study in these subjects but in future i might do and i have plan to do it in soas. i don't know the person you named from soas but i heard about him, probably from a friend.
i'm not sure if the book is translated in english, but its a very old book...nearly 100 years old. so it could be traslated. you can try this shop...i know that they have the bengali version and if the don't have english, they might be able to help you to find it.
Mira U.K.
57, Fashion Street
London
E1 6P6
Tel: 00 44 207 377 6688.
i will keep my eyes and ears open, if i come accross of anything i will let you know. let me know how it goes and all the best for your thesis.
Bijli :)
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Shankar_Chakravarti
Shankar_Chakravart
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
06/13/05 at 11:44:14 » |
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[quote author=Bijili link=board=0011&num=1115983967&start=15#22 date=06/12/05 at 16:53:46]
i keep interests in languages specially in bengali and in sanskrit but its only an interest.
[/quote]
Dear Bijili,
I am looking for a site where Bengali to Bengali on line dictionary is available. Do you know any such site ? If it is of any interest to you, I am giving two Sanskrit dictionary sites. If the site addresses are not already known to you, it may help to increase your immensely vast knowledge.
http://www.alkhemy.com/sanskrit/dict/
http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia/ebooks/mw/0100/mw__0153.html
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Jimut
Jimut
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
06/13/05 at 20:15:11 » |
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Bengali to Bengali dictionary ?? Online ??
Ita abar emon ki boro kotha ???
Ami-i to aasi !!! ;D ;D |
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didibhai
Kavita_Gupta
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Re: Sylheti ... a dialect or a seperate language ?
«on:
06/14/05 at 02:56:03 » |
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Thank you Bijili for getting back to me. I will contact the shop in question when I return from holiday. Its nice to hear you are a fashion designer, perhaps you can have a spot in my next venture, online magazine for Asian women diaspora, Bindimag.com coming soon. Log on to my other site www.mahilamag.com
I am just a small time editor of small time publications. I have been trying to finish my thesis for my masters for the last couple years but it is very difficult to gather info. on sylheti Hindu's, focussing on the political upheaval of the partition. But, I won't give up. I am also very interested in Bengali and Sanskrit but my knowledge is very poor on both.
From your posting it seems that you live in the East London area. I also lived in North London for 9 years after I got married, but the civil service life was too boring to endure. So I left and came back to my home town, in the north of England. I do know most people in East London, specially Sylheti, so it may transpire that I know you too. I have just found out another person whom I wrote to via the London room and turned out that she is related to my younger sister through her in-laws. Small world hey!
Any way, off to Italy for a week. Hope the weather is better than here, it seems that the freeze just doesn't want to die out here.
Chow. |
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