India Shining Give ur Comments

Author  Topic: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments.....     Biswajit Acharjee Biswajit_Acharjee India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments.....   «on: 05/14/04 at 14:22:58 »    This is some information on prospective PM of India - Sonia Gandhi that every Indian and at least every India lover must know. 1..  Sonia Gandhi is ONLY a high school graduate. It is not even sure if she is Matric pass or fail. Cambridge University has confirmed that they have no Sonia Maino on their alumni list. 2..  Her sister, Nadia Mario, who had never visited India before rushed to New Delhi, after Vajpayee govt.fell, to be by her side amidst reports that she might soon become India's Prime Minister. 3..  Should Sonia Gandhi become Prime Minister, her relatives in Italy would be fully entitled to round-the-clock protection by the Black Cat commandos at the Indian taxpayer's expense. 4..  She worked as an house maid in UK while taking classes to learn English in some no name school. She was from a poor family in Italy but now has almost as much money as Bill Gates (guess whose money is it). 5..  During the 1971 war, while all Indians stood ready to fight for the Indian cause Sonia Maino and her husband Rajiv Gandhi went on vacation in Italy. 6..  In 1977, when Indira Gandhi and Congress lost elections, Sonia Gandhi with her children and husband in tow took refuge of Italian embassy in New Delhi. Only after Indira Gandhi, Sanjay and his Indian wife Maneka convinced her that they came back. 7..  Sonia married Rajiv in 1968 and was eligible to become Indian citizen 5 years later yet she did NOT become Indian citizen till 1984 I.e. 16 years after her marriage) This late bloom of Sonia's love for India also was out of political consideration. In 1984, Rajiv, was heir apparent and most likely next Prime Minister. It would be awkward for a PM to have a foreigner wife. Voila, Sonia became an Indian Overnight. 8..  She has not given a single interview or offered any ideas on a single issue facing India now. Her only qualification is that she married a Gandhi. No newspaper has taken up the issue; no political party is opposing this, people are falling in line as if this is nothing unusual. 9..  Sonia became an Indian citizen in 1984 but did not surrender her Italian citizenship. She continues to be simultaneously a citizen of India and Italy as Italian law does not require her to surrender her Italian citizenship or passport. Simply put, Sonia is a dual citizen of India and Italy now dreaming of becoming the next Prime Minister of India (she can also legally become the prime minister of Italy!)... Only thing we can do..is just drop couple of tears..we can't do any thing...cos...every body is busy in their own manner and nobody cares for any thing...All this is just for vested political and personal interests.     guest Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/14/04 at 23:39:46 »    No all this is because this country's majority is still uneducated and can be made to believe on stupid sentimental stuff like "Indira hamari beti thi aur yeh hamari bahu hai, jise desh ke liye vidhwa hona para" and all that nonsense. Its those gullible people who actually elect the party that governs us all....not you and me.     confused confused Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 01:26:47 »    Prime ministership has been outsourced to Italy. Good job Indians. Brainless commnists are supporting her too.     sidney Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 01:51:07 »    Don't blame people for their illiteracy or stupidity. Whoever with high school diploma or foreign-born will be lucky enough to become a PM. Unless we reform the election, things like that will continue for ever.     guest Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 01:56:22 »    No amount of election reform will work unless the population is mature enough. that's a basic flaw of democracy.the majority wins and if the majority happens to be stupid and illiterate, then you get what they want or what they think they want.     soniagandhi Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 15:29:14 »    Text of Sonia Gandhi's speech May 15, Following is the text of the speech of newly elected Congress Parliamentary Party leader Sonia Gandhi at the Central Hall of Parliament: Friends, You have honoured me by reposing your trust and faith in me. I feel deeply humbled, I feel greatly privileged. I stand here today, in the space once occupied by my greatest teachers -- Panditji, Indiraji and Rajivji. Their lives have guided me throughout my journey. Their courage and complete devotion to India has given me the strength to continue on their path even years after their martyrdom. Also Read   Sonia elected CPP leader Rahul stars in mother's moment of glory   I would like to remember them today, I would like to honour them today. Friends, we stand here as elected members of this August House as per the will of the people of our great nation. Let us never forget that it is to them we owe our positions. Let us never slip, for even one moment. At all times, we must act in their interest, at all times we must acknowledge that it is their mandate that has given us this immense responsibility, at all times we must be conscious of the truth that we are in fact, their humble servants. Let us not revel in our victory. Let us greet it as a welcome opportunity to effect the changes that may better the lives of our brothers and sisters all over India. Let us understand the sentiment behind this mandate. Let us each acknowledge that the people of India have chosen us to represent their aspirations not our own. The people of India have spoken. They have once again re-affirmed what we all believed within our hearts. They have asserted that the soul of our nation is inclusive, secular and united. They have decisively rejected the ideology of the likes of the RSS. They have decisively rejected the destructive and self-serving policies of the BJP-NDA government. They have decisively rejected the politics of personal attacks and negative campaigns. Very shortly a Congress-led coalition will be in place at the Centre. Even as we provide the pivot for the coalition, it will be our earnest endeavour to respect and work closely with our allies and partners. We will soon finalise a joint plan of action with them. This plan will outline our priorities, policies and programmes as one cohesive unit. The commitment to provide a strong and stable government dedicated to promoting social harmony and peace unites all of us in the coalition. The commitment to provide a firm, resolute government devoted to the welfare of the kisans and khet mazdoors, of youth and women, of weaker sections of society unites us all in the coalition. The commitment to provide a purposeful, effective government focused on accelerating employment, growth and investment unites all of us in the coalition. We have an enormous task ahead of us. The road is wrought with difficulties, the challenges are vast. Let us not be complacent. Our party organisation has to be infused with new energy and drive. In many states we have not performed as we should have. There is now a momentum generated by our revival -- let us not squander it. We must utilise it as a catalyst for change and progress within our own organisation. Let us build a new future defined by hard work and resolve. I know that you have all worked tremendously hard in the last few months. I would like to extend my heartiest congratulations to each one of you and express to you, my heartfelt gratitude. I am glad to see a number of young men and women who have joined the House today. A special word of greeting to them and a special thought for all those who fought hard but could not make it. We have succeeded against all odds. We have prevailed despite all predictions of disaster. It has been a team effort, a collective enterprise. We can take legitimate pride in our accomplishment as we prepare ourselves for the task of governance in the days ahead. On behalf of all of you, I thank the people of India from my heart.     raghuvir raghuvir Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 20:12:05 »    ofocurse it wil be debated for ages to  to come now as to what exaclty went wrong for NDA....have my 2 pennies worth of opinion too...... 1.advanis yatra- was one of the daftest peices of movies in the gr8 man's political career.i know for a fact how many in south india( where i am based now) who were grudingly admitting tht BJP governemnt had done a good job and maybe desrved a 2nd chance' all turned against BJP..coz the common feeling was this was tht this si the ture face of BJP and wht vajpayee is offering is jes a diluted version of the RSS ideology...belive me..."mandi vahi banega"...is stupider than " indira humari bet..yeh humari bahu"...Advani probably felt tht vajpayee has made his plac ein history and history will pass him by..so decided to once gain show wht hes made of.....in turn jes made sure the fence sitters play it safe again...old adage" known enemy better than unknown frend" 2.who in his right mind would have gone wit jayalilta..the way she had antognised govt employees..and TN is a  govt employee state if u can call it tht...a washout was apparent... 3.the constant foreigner issue bogey....sumon shud tell BJP ...it doesnt work..it doesnt matter....if u want to..pls ask question abut her ability..u will hear a lot of "yah"..but u keep trying to make it personal and make non-issues into issues..it jes shows ur bankruptcy of ideas... for gods sake..if need to talk abut foreigners...pls talk abut the IMDT act than Sonia...we indians hve been the most wonderful of cultures  which assimilate whtever coems to it...it doesnt take awy from being a "hindu"..hasnt for thousand of years..... 4. chandra babu naidu is reigning over what is now known as the suicide belt of Asia..no way he was going to get back to power jes coz he got the 2 bills( clinton n gates) hve dinner with him in hyderbad....how does tht affect a ppoor daily wage earner...hyderbad( for tht matter bangalore) were not even 5 percent fo the total seats in the assembly in their respective states...u cant expect to win on account of development in tht small belt...     raghuvir raghuvir Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 20:26:08 »    guest the majority is not stupid..illiterate maybe....pls come down to andhra..have  alook at the rural folks..they hve  a worse life thabn rural people in assam..and i used to think nothin can be more backward than this....just by shouting from roooftops tht "india is shining" will not do anything... politcians/opinion polls/and people like u/indian film makers underestimate the intllegince of our people a lot....so even when the suprhit man subhash ghai makes a crap film..they watch it...they might watch 2....they dont take a 3rd one.....they banish it so fast and so badly tht subhash ghai will think rest of his life before directing another movie...poor people are patient...wait n wait n wait for things to happen...if they dont...which is the usual case..they wait a lil more for the elctions...and use tht vote...a thing which Mr guest, u and me dont do a lot often..and we both shud be ashamed for it....u call it the "flaw of democracy"? its the beauty of democracy....the will of the people shall prevail....no amount of smart campagin managers like arun jaitley,prmod mahajan( 2 of the finest people in politics in todays day n age mind u) will help anyone if people hve made upt hier minds tht sumon has to go.......do what u want..dont question our system of democracy....     Sandipan Suklabaidya Sandipan, Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 22:16:31 »    " We the people of India, are emotional fools" 8)     sidney Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 23:24:39 »    If we don't like democracy because it has some flaws, which system we should undertake to make everybody's life better? Should we follow Singapure's example to take the stringent steps so no one cannot play foul of the system? Should we go by the Chinese rules? Why cannot we try to experiemnt the different systems to find which one will apply to us in a fairly way? We all know that most of the foreign countries won't cooperate with us unless we are for democracy. Look at WB. Thye are playing hard bargain when dealing with the foreign investments, most of which come from the democratic countries, which are looking for cheap labor. I don't understand if it's a double standard, hypocrisy or grab for power. So, it's very difficult to know if democracy is good for all of us. Yes, I have enjoyed it very much from my own perspective, but at the same time, it is sad to see the majority of the people were not able to prosper (live better) even during the 56-year span since independence. Maybe, the population explosion is the reason, that suppresses the economic opportunities. Maybe, I am wrong because the rising population means to protect the country from the barbaric attack by neighboring/foreign invadres or maybe, it will soon become a economic powerhouse so the foreign companies will find many market opportunities in India with over 1 billion population.     guest Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/15/04 at 23:57:29 »    [quote author=raghuvir link=board=0011&num=1084535578&start=0#7 date=05/15/04 at 20:26:08] guest the majority is not stupid..illiterate maybe....pls come down to andhra..have  alook at the rural folks..they hve  a worse life thabn rural people in assam..and i used to think nothin can be more backward than this....just by shouting from roooftops tht "india is shining" will not do anything... [/quote] And what has anyone gotten from the 45 years of Congress rule....isn't that a pointer for things to come ? So if someone is not stupid or has vested interests, what other reason can there be to vote these buggers in. I am not saying that the NDA was all great or anything but look at what they did in 5 years and compare that to what the Congress achieved in 45 years ? Atleast it did something for the middle class, the Congress didn't do squat...middle or lower. The development percolates down slowly and everybody would have benefited if the NDA govt. stayed for another term. Now its a new ball game with the left clamouring for stopping privatisation and with Mulayam and Laloo types ruling the roost, you can rest assured that it won't benefit anyone...not even the people who thought that the India shining thing wasn't really shining on them.     raghuvir raghuvir Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/16/04 at 10:22:14 »    well noone was saying congress rule was any better.....but to say tht wht this governemt did in 5 yrs  cong cud not in 45 years..thts wht the media managers of BJP want u to believe. agreed license raj was a thing of the congress....but who dismantled it in '91..who raised the bogey of swadeshi then..BJP!...our industries wud be wiped out etc etc....no one doubts tht this governemnt(bjp) gave us some of the best and most dynamic minsiters tht we ever had..but it was more to do with indivual brilliance than with any structure to produce brilliance..coz as time showed..there was lil to choose from BJps functioning and congress's functioning...wht wit party presidents taking money live on telly... yes it takes time for benifitto flow down the masses..and whom we have to thank it for....mr manmahon singh..not a certain my roll back sinha... how can one forget gujarat....imagine tht kind of chaos in rest of the country...becoz the underlining fear inspite of all tht patches of brilliance from BJP is tht the fascists will take ove rn ruin the secular fabric of the country..ya call me tht fancy term pseduo secularist if u hve to....i dont mind..but my india is for indians..not just hindus....makes me an emotional fool...am ready to lvie wt tht..than live on the body count of 15 crore muslims...i dont want mandirs..i want schools,colleges,  state of the art hosiptals.and if sumon doesnt get the message i will not vote for him... http://sify.com/news/columns/fullstory.php?id=13476178     raghuvir raghuvir Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/16/04 at 10:41:38 »    the left....thts thing to give anyone sleepless nights..no one wants to see them in helm of issues....thts the big minus of the this genreal elections..the fact tht they hve been able to come up as king makers..or close to tht.. http://sify.com/news/columns/fullstory.php?id=13476178     Sonia Ka Rajiv IUnknown Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/17/04 at 07:05:29 »    There is not point debating over the educational qualification os people and other irrelevant issues Mr B Acharjee. There are a lot of changes which become inevitable becoz someone did not play the role he was entrusted with as desired. The BJP set out to win the election on some false propoganda and gimmicks. "India is not Shinning". The 10% GDP growth is s h i t. Vis-a-vis the last year when the GDP  was -7% , 10% makes no sense. There was a marked lack of dedication and complacency in the activities of the BJP men and even the man- AB. Raking up issues of foreign citizen is meaningless. In the open verdict this issue was killed. And see what happened to the foolhardy JJ, who couldn't win even 1 seat. Indian electorate has yet to reach the levels of maturity exhibited by voters in developed countries.Yet they are not fools. They desire better governance. Does your policeman behave well with you today? The anser is no. The verdict is for a change. For the UMC, with tech jobs, India shines. But for others there is no respite. Congress as a party did a chanceless campaign and ws rewarded. There was no Sari-Kelankari.  :( They played their cards well. They won. Hopefully they will deliver the goods they promised. Don't be like the Indian Crab. Let the prosperous prosper. You try to Prosper too. ::) Remember the INC was founded by another foreigner Allan Octavian Hume.  :) India's cricket team is coached by a Kiwi, just as Michael Schumaker is trained by a Sikh - Balbir Singh.  :) This is the the age of globalisation. Think global and not like a 'kupamandoook'  :)     deep123 Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/17/04 at 12:24:24 »    Hello Everyone,         Wht to say out of 100 crores the CONG can't choose any leader who has got the right capability to run the world largest democracy why not they can't choose they can choose but today Sonia will be becoming PM not b'coz of her capability(but she had got the greatest quality she is wife of Rajiv, bahu of Indira) but b'coz of the jealousy among Indians. If they choose anyone except Sonia then the internal politics will start ...b'coz we Indians are thinking of only ourselves .I m   not blaming anyone but the people of this country don't know anything specially those who r in rural areas may this will hurt the sentiments of lots of people ..but sorry to say only b'coz of those people we r in a situation where our country is to be run by a someone who don't have any knowledge about india .... who even after becoming CLP leader 5 yrs back cannot give a single speech without seeing the porcha... disgusting ....and the Left front ....i think they should give up all the idealogy and rename the party's name as DUMMY CONGRESS and only idealogy is to stop non-secular parties ...by non-secular they point towards BJP but NDA runned the govt. for 5 yrs and everyone has seen them except gujarat(in gujarat who started first surjeet should see it) can surjeet give another instance of riot ..i don't think so ....and today only b'coz of those left front,laloo,mulayam,mayawati ...the country is at such situation they will get seats b'coz they know how to fool indians ...and today i will say it's better if India has got presendential form of govt. Deep     Pheluda Guest Re: India Shining!!!!! Give ur Comments..   «on: 05/17/04 at 13:00:05 »    Kupamandook - definitely yes. When you do not know how these spineless leaders, afraid of loosing out the elections. choose sonia as their 'Shikhondi'. Only that Gandhi Name could save them from the voters - because this country votes for Dipika as 'Ma Sita'. Yes, Kupamandook - when you voted thses left parties and then see them comment like idiot fools that leaves the economy in doldrums. Unless u r a kupo... what you could have done. They know if Sonia does not take the PM post - others will run riot for the posts. Now the decoits of Mulayam and Lallo will also join the party. You must be a kupo .. if u could not see this danger. Lonkat gele sob ei Rabon - ei kotha koiya gele gia hoito nay. Ja asha dekha gesil sob taar barota baajbo. Kita koin sonia ka rajiv?     Sonia Ka Rajiv IUnknown Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/17/04 at 15:38:50 »    Indians as a race are an impatient lot.  >:( They want instant results without waiting to spend sufficient time. There is no point in speculating that something will not work out for some superficial reasons. Just as the fact that a girl who loses her virginity doesn't necessarily become another harlot, so also a new person becoming the PM of India doesn't mean it's all over. 8) Men just don't perish. They perish because they lose their judgement power and the ablity to adapt themselves to change. :) Change is the only constant in life. Deny it and you will perish. Accept it and only then India will Shine.  :)     Dr Baharul Islam Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/17/04 at 16:47:57 »    Dear Friends on Silchar.com Mahadda: It has been a very long time since I posted something on this space. Today the debate is so interesting that it compelled me to put some humble words. Hope it wil be taken in its right spirit. 1. Do we believe in the democracy which is the main identity of India as a great nation ? If we do we must respect the collective verdict of the people no matter how much it goes aginst our personal liking or disliking. Just becuase it did not go my way I can not castigate the people of India as they know nothing. In fact the rural folks knows much more about the real politic than educated elite like us. We should respect the democratic tradition we follow. Poor or rich, educated or uneducated everyone one of us have one vote. Otherwise we have to adopt policies of countries like Kuwat which did not give voting right to women untill this week thinking that women knows nothing. We will do the same mistake if we overlook the wishes of the majority. 2. Today in the global economy and pluratistic cultiral age where racial/national origins are marred and where each of us compete with every other nationas and nationalities on the ground individual capabilities its meaningless to talk about someone origin of birth. The fact is that Mrs Gandhi is as much as an Indian as thousands of people from Indian orgins are now American or Canadian. I remember people of Indian origin are getting elected to British Parliament and even a school dropout from Punjub becoming Chief Minister (I dont remember the excat position) of British Columbia in Canada a few years ago. What is the problem if a person of Italian origin has accepted Indian citizenship, shown interest in rebuliding a party from a difficult situation and has managed to retain the leadership of that party to the extent that she is elected leader of her party and supported by partners. 3. Today, those of us work in international arena know very well that origin does not matter what matters is individual strength and qualities. I am sure thousands of Indians do more harm to India everyday (think of the greedy Custom officials whom we meet right from the moment we enter India) than an Italian born can do. So, let us brace ourselves for making India more properous by contributing whatever way we can ... the lines from JFK's speech is very apt here rather than discussing origin issues. To have alast laugh ...do you think born Indian CM Rabri Devi will be a better option if Laloo Yadav has his way (he had it in Bihar as we all know, got the party back to power again under her leadership). Psephologists beaware! Long live India...long live Indian democracy. Bahar     sidney Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/18/04 at 01:12:40 »    Why not give Sonia an little bit opportunity to see how she will govern India from her expereince as a Rajiv's wife. If she is qualified, won't she be lucky? On the other hand, the things don't change much under her rule, you will probably see some political fallout, which will prove in history that someone with experience as waitress can't be a PM without proven skills in politics.     guest Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/18/04 at 05:43:07 »    Its not about the foreign origins of Sonia Gandhi that should be bugging us as much as the apprehension of what is to come. The jitters are not  mine alone. Look at Monday's stock market reaction, which was a little over-the-top panic, but panic nonetheless caused by a sense of apprehension seeing the types of Harkishan Singh Surjeet trying to set the economic agenda of the next government. That's not a path we as a nation ought to be taking, and I guess the lack of maturity in the voters to comprehend this, is worrying.     Biswajit Acharjee Biswajit_Acharjee Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/18/04 at 09:08:56 »    Mr Sonia Ka Rajiv... Its not a matter of Kupomunduk-ta ...or what ever...and I think INC could find other candidate as their leader.... And if we believe that the current era is for Globalisation, Libralisation and economic reforms than I also do feel that Rahul Gandhi/Jotiraditya Syndia can know these adjectives batter than Sonia..     lonewolf lonewolf Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/18/04 at 09:13:20 »       "VENI VEDI VICI"                   or                      "I CAME, I SAW, I CONQUERED"     These words by Julius Ceaser the architect of the Roman (a la Italia) Empire has suddenly made some of us very hypothetical and speculate things which are purely imaginary.      Regarding Sonia Gandhi..she definetly came, she saw and she conquered.            What she conquered is a matter of debate..is it the hopes and aspirations(to a some extent fascination) of the people...or their VOTES ...the post of the PM...or as some say the country.             So for us who think ourselves to be the blessed and the fortunate lot of our country its better to have a apolitical view and critically analyse the situation as it unfolds rather than going BLAH BLAH on some twisted facts which are entirely out of imagination.    (Mr BISWAJIT ACHARJEE needs to give some explanations in this case)                        Hope this Debate continues.....     Biswajit Acharjee Biswajit_Acharjee Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/18/04 at 16:03:08 »    Dear Mr. lonewolf... I am not here to debate on Sonia as PM..I DONT HAVE THAT MUCH OF TIME.. I started this thread just to know from u people "Is our India Shining!!" seeing the verdict of our 100 crores population.....     Amitav Guest GREAT NEWS-Sonia is not becoming PM   «on: 05/18/04 at 20:23:24 »    AT last good sense prevailed on Sonia Miano and till now(11-23 PM IST,18th May) she is refusing to up the PM's post.Though her dogs kept on pestering her to be the PM . Hopefully if Monmohan Singh becomes the PM then our economy will start looking up.Other wise  the economy was getting domed becasue of the leftists(pigs) irresponsible comments about the reform process. In that case it does not matter if Congress or BJP is in power as long as the reforms are carried out.  It seems after the current stock market crash,the leftists will be prevented from making any irresponsible statements.     guest Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/18/04 at 21:05:31 »    If Manmohan Singh becomes the PM, then I think we don't need to sulk as much. He is a very capable person(not sure about his political acumen) and the economy will be in good hands, but one thing is for sure that the leftists will still exert a lot of pressure as they know that this Govt. can't function without their support. That's where the worry is.     xelnaga Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 04:57:42 »    Mashuq ka budhaapa bhi kya lazzat dikha raha hai .. angur ka mazaa kismis mein aa raha hai ;D     Shankar_Chakravarti Shankar_Chakravart Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 05:59:22 »    Did Kalam’s poser have Sonia back off? New Delhi, May 18: Speculation is rife about why Congress president Sonia Gandhi is reluctant to become Prime Minister of India. One source reported that Sonia changed her mind because the President may have raised objections to her rights as a naturalised citizen during their meeting at noon on Tuesday. After being elected the leader of the Congress Parliamentary Party, Sonia first expressed her reluctance on Monday night. She then relented and everybody thought the matter was settled. But the situation changed dramatically after she met President A P J Abdul Kalam at noon on Tuesday. Her sudden change of mind strengthened speculation that all did not go well in that meeting. The President is said to have informed her that according to Section 5 of the Citizenship Act of 1955, she has no right to assume the office of the Prime Minister of India and that he was seeking the advice of the Supreme Court on this issue. Section 5 of the Citizenship Act of 1955 says the rights and privileges allowed to foreigners who become citizens by application (not by birth) are conditional upon the rights and privileges granted to Indians in the country of the concerned person’s origin (in this case Italy). The President reportedly told Sonia that he had to ascertain the legal position in this matter as there was no confirmation that all the rights and privileges granted to persons of Italian origin are reciprocated by Italy in the case of Indians who become citizens of that country. Sonia is said to have decided not to take the risk after the President’s briefing. It should also be noted that the President, in his letter on Monday, invited her only to “discuss” assuming the post of Prime Minister, and not to assume office. Janata Party president Subramanian Swamy, who met the President earlier, reportedly argued that Sonia was not eligible to become Prime Minister as it contravened the provisions of the Citizenship Act. CPI-M Somnath Chatterjee said that her children, Priyanka and Rahul, objected to her taking up the post because they feared for her life. “Her children say they have lost their father and do not want to lose their mother. We cannot give any assurance. This is a violent country,” Chatterjee said. Others gave more credit to the agitation threats by K Govindacharya, Uma Bharti and Sushma Swaraj. Some also asked whether she was resorting to dramatics to extract rock-solid assurances from internal and external rivals. Sources also said she may have been apprehensive about her ability to face the onslaught of BJP stalwarts like Atal Behari Vajpayee and L K Advani in Parliament http://www.deccan.com/home/homedetails.asp#Did Kalam’s poser have Sonia back off? (  Deccan Chronicle, Hyderabad,  Wednesday, May 19, 2004 )     Shankar_Chakravarti Shankar_Chakravart Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 13:21:45 »    Kalam did not raise citizenship issue Onkar Singh in New Delhi | May 19, 2004 15:52 IST The Rashtrapati Bhavan has denied that President A P J Abdul Kalam raised the issue of citizenship during his meeting with Congress president Sonia Gandhi on Tuesday. "The matter was not discussed at all," S M Khan, the President's press secretary, told rediff.com A leading daily had said that Kalam asked her about Article 5 of the Constitution, which refers to citizenship. Bharatiya Janata Party leaders Sushma Swaraj and Govindacharaya, met the President and raised the issue of Gandhi's foreign origin, he said. "The President simply heard them out." http://in.rediff.com/election/2004/may/19onkar.htm     santabanta Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 18:06:04 »    yes India Shining now !!!!!! chak de phattey ! 'Manmohan Singh Zindabad' !!! 'Jo Bole Sao Nihal, Saath Sri Akal'. Sonia gandhi zindabad !     Stranger_sandy Stranger_sandy Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 19:44:48 »    Dear Baharul Sir. Read your note, seems to be intersting. I really appreciate your words. Nice to read a intellect after a long time in Silchar.com. As it's a open Forum I hope you won't mind to listen to me on some of your points. 1. Yes india is a great Nation, About 1Bn people are proud to be an Indian. But don't you think it will be a shame offering an Italian one of the highest chair of the nation. It's not something about what we slected or elected, it's a matter of pride. As I am also from a village of Assam I too know rural floks know much better polictics than us, but I think their polictics is some how encirlced by village boundaries, most of them are not concerned about Global market, Global oil price hike etc. etc. They will be more happy to lead a subsidised life than to be a global leader in any front. Yes we Indians are much better, than atleast Kuwaitians, as we respect Women, and till now we consider Mrs. Indira Gandhi as the best PM. and the majority you are talking about is not enough to form a government, if you talk about the coalision force then I believe those rural folks who voted for any of those qualition parties voted for Sonia Gandhi. I agree Sonia Gandhi Salvaged Congress, but that doesn't give any right to congress leaders to elect Sonia Gandhi as PM of India (who became Indian citizen when she smelt it's gonna be good for her political career) 2. Yes today world has become a local word, and ask us who are far away from our beautiful nation who didn't even voted for any of these leaders/ parties. People laugh at us saying out of you 1 bn Indians, don't have a Indian born PM. Definitely there are lots of Indians in lots of big positions and we are proud of it, but probably no one in such a prestigious position like PM. Forget about countries like Fiji, being a citizen of such a great nation and a global player we should think big and should compare us with big players. And if you do some more research on those Indians (who are in big positions) you will find they are in those position not because they married to some citizen of those country but because of their education, their quality and because they are the best bid for the postion they are holding and we 1 Bn Indians (including rural Folks) are proud of it. For one second let me assume Sonia Gandhi is choice of rural Indians (as you said) and she should be PM. Then sir as a citizen of a democracy people like me don't they have any right to say or be proud of, and I must say I won't be proud of it. 3. Congress emerged as single largest party. A party who has got the best educated leaders, how can you compare them with Rabri Devi. Don't you think Manmohan Singh or Pranab Mukherjee or Jairam Ramesh or someone like them is a better bid than Sonia Gandhi whose only qualification is Rajib Gandhi's widow. Like Ravri Devi wife of Laloo Yadav. I am sure you will replace Ravri devi with Sonia gandhi after few days, like I got a mail from some one saying India's future PM (and the picture was of Rahul gandhi's columbian girl-friend; she is pretty though) Anyway while I am typing these I got the news that President Invited Manmohan Singh to form Govt. That's the news, the father Indian Economic reform is going to be the PM of India. Don't you think he deserves it and the right candidate to be PM of India, and I am sure those rural folks of my village too will be very happy. God less India and Indians Vande Maatram, Sandy     Amitav Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 20:21:15 »    Dont worry guys ,if this Receptionist  cum one time Maid Servant(in England) could'nt become PM,so what one day her son's Columbian Girl friend (a waitress)will definitely become our PM some time in the future .We will demand a Dinner party from you guys then. Frankly speaking ,the famous white house intern Monika Lewnisky would have been a much better choice  than Sonia Gandhi     Feel Good Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 20:44:56 »    Whatever it is mr amitav.. your rotten dirty mind is not worth any comment.. This election, Sonia had almost single handedly thrashed bjp. I understand it is a great pain for you to accept this.. what else can you do now except showing your true color ? Wonder, what dirty campaign now is in sangh parivar's hand for Manmohan.     premasish_deb Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/19/04 at 21:55:40 »    Just one point.. Sonia didnot single handedly thrash BJP. Congress is an old party with deep roots in most parts of India. And people mostly voted for their own local candidates. When we voted for Santosh Mohan Deb in Silchar we did not vote for Sonia as PM. I am sure if it was a presidential form of government and Vajpayee contested against Sonia, it would have been a very different story.     lonewolf lonewolf Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/20/04 at 00:43:11 »    To Mr. Biswajit Acharjee....     So Mr. Acharjee you may think that you don't have much time but you know one thing...You are an expert in changing colours like a Chameleon in notime.        You may have started this thread and I am happy you could remember that you have done it to discuss about the India Shining issue and have aptly named it as "India Shining!!!!!! Give ur Comments".          On opening the thread I was simply shocked to find that you have not only deviated but completely dodged off the said issue and you have presented some concocted facts about Mrs Sonia Gandhi. This prompted me and so I made my point of view known to you through my reply in this thread.        If you fail to recollect what you have written then help yourself by reading the following lines. I quote from your text,             "..  Sonia became an Indian citizen in 1984 but did not surrender her Italian citizenship. She continues to be simultaneously a citizen of India and Italy as Italian law does not require her to surrender her Italian citizenship or passport. Simply put, Sonia is a dual citizen of India and Italy now dreaming of becoming the next Prime Minister of India (she can also legally become the prime minister of Italy!)..."                      Mr. Acharjee you probably did'nt know that Indian Law requires her to surrender her Italian PASSPORT and citizenship in favour of full Indian citizenship and the Italian Law applies only to countries in the EU.              This is a reply to just one of your points, the other points that you made are simply rubbish and a mere fascination of your concoction. So I hope the thing is clear now.               If you have TIME I shall be happy to expect a decorous reply from you.           sam Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/20/04 at 02:59:52 »    Well guys why dont you give her a chance to prove her worthiness. Every political leader has a history behind him or her. We Indians, specially bengalees are no one to criticise but dont see how many Indians are holding good political grip abroad.     Amitav Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/20/04 at 12:38:06 »    Mr Feel Good or Lone Wolf Bhai, I would have been very happy to see Sonia Gandhi as our PM if she has demonstrated her Intellect and capability like our NRI brothers have done abroad  to achieve any political positions. She does'nt have any Qualiifcation other than being from the Gandhi family and which her Columbian Compatriot will do the same . Any way it was a great relief ,thanks to our President pointing her the door thru Section 5 of the Citizenship Act,1955.     sakuntala Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/20/04 at 15:40:49 »    Dear Amitav : I am happy that being a hotel bell boy/waiter (whatever u r ) u have some gud knowld abt indian citizenship act ! by the way cud u plz tell me u got work permit or u r working in abroad (as a floor boy /waiter ) ilegelly! [quote author=Amitav link=board=0011&num=1084535578&start=30#35 date=05/20/04 at 12:38:06] Mr Feel Good or Lone Wolf Bhai, I would have been very happy to see Sonia Gandhi as our PM if she has demonstrated her Intellect and capability like our NRI brothers have done abroad  to achieve any political positions. She does'nt have any Qualiifcation other than being from the Gandhi family and which her Columbian Compatriot will do the same . Any way it was a great relief ,thanks to our President pointing her the door thru Section 5 of the Citizenship Act,1955. [/quote]     lonewolf lonewolf Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/20/04 at 21:01:21 »    Actually Mr. Amitab you see I don't subscribe to either Congress's or BJP's real polity. I am apolitical and love to call myself a critic. All I want is an honest, efficient and a professionally qualified man as the country's PM which I think Dr.Manmohan Singh is. We must learn to give credit where the credit is due and this time Mrs. Sonia Gandhi takes all the credit not only for her cunning (a la sacrificing) move but also for nominating Dr.Singh who is neither from Lok Shaba nor a populist/mass leader.   We had enough of the populist type leaders as ministers who are boring, professionally less qualified and intellectually bottle necked.   Regarding BJP I think they have done a decent job in some particular sectors like Foreign Policy and Defence and for the Economic policies, anyone who overlooks the 400 million Indians who earn less than Rs 30 a day is bound to have the same fate.But sorry I can't stand the extreme Hindutwa that many of their leaders practice  and I find some of their leaders even more boring and comical than the Laloos.   Regarding the President's objection,I think you are a bit uninformed. The matter has already been clarified by the President's office. Now for the Citizenship Act of 1955 w r t Sonia Gandhi I think the information below from FRONTLINE will help to make the matter clearer to you...  "....There is no dispute over the fact that Sonia Gandhi qualified for citizenship through naturalisation as laid down by the citizenship law and rules. She could not have applied for citizenship by registration until 1986. Before 1986, only people of Indian origin, if they had resided in India for six months before the date of their application, qualified for citizenship by registration. Sonia Gandhi's only qualification for Indian citizenship by registration was her marriage with Rajiv Gandhi. However, for this she might have had to wait until 1986 when Section 5 (c) was inserted in the Citizenship Act, 1955, through an amendment. The inserted section enables a foreign spouse marrying an Indian citizen to acquire Indian citizenship by registration, if he or she has resided in India for five years at the time of applying. Sonia Gandhi, therefore, became an Indian citizen in 1983 by naturalisation as provided for under Section 6 of the Citizenship Act, 1955. This section enables any person not born in India or having Indian parents to become an Indian citizen if he or she has resided in the country for at least eight years on the date of application. The person concerned must have resided in the country throughout the eighth year. (The 1986 amendment increased the residence requirement to 13 years.) It is clear that Sonia Gandhi fulfilled the residence requirement. Section 6 of the Citizenship Act enables the Centre to grant a certificate of naturalisation to foreigners, other than those living in the Commonwealth countries and Ireland, if they seek Indian citizenship and fulfil the conditions specified in the Thir d Schedule of the Act. The Centre can waive any or all of the conditions specified in the Third Schedule if, in its opinion, the applicant is a person who has rendered distinguished service to the cause of science, philosophy, art, literature, world peac e or human progress. In Sonia Gandhi's case, there can be no doubt that she sought Indian citizenship through fulfilling the conditions specified in the Third Schedule. The first condition is that the applicant is not a citizen of any country where citizens of India are ''prevented by law or practice'' of that country from becoming citizens of that country by naturalisation. Frontline has confirmed after enquiry (see box) that in Italy, there are no such restrictions on Indians or other foreigners from becoming citizens by naturalisation. Unlike India, Italy does not impose any restriction on its citizens enjoying dual or even multiple citizenship. The only exce ptions are those provided by the Strasbourg Convention of May 6, 1963 on the reduction of double or multiple citizenship, which deals mostly with European countries. Nor does Italy restrict its high constitutional posts or any public office or elective p osition to natural-born citizens. Under the Italian Constitution and law, any person who has acquired Italian citizenship has the same rights as an Italian citizen by birth. The second important condition in the Third Schedule is that if the applicant is a citizen of any other country, he or she must renounce its citizenship in accordance with the law in force there, and notify such renunciation to the Central Government. Su ch restriction on dual citizenship in India stems from the nationalist moorings of the early years of the Indian republic, when undivided citizenship was considered a strength and a patriotic imperative. Sonia Gandhi's enemies have speculated, without do ing any home work, that she may not have renounced her citizenship of Italy since that country allows dual citizenship. Senior Congress(I) leader Pranab Mukherjee asserted that she surrendered her Italian passport on April 27, 1983, thereby relinquishing her Italian citizenship. Her political enemies refused to accept this assertion and demanded documentary proof. But what was strange was that a statutory provision for dual citizenship in Italy, which in no way prevented an Italian citizen from volu ntarily giving up Italian citizenship, was being bandied about in the Indian political marketplace as ammunition to use against one who had been indisputably an Indian citizen for 16 years. On May 20, a Congress(I) press statement revealed that she appl ied for Indian citizenship on April 7, 1983, got it on April 13 and renounced her Italian citizenship on April 27, 1983. Sonia Gandhi also fulfilled another condition laid down in the Third Schedule that she must have adequate knowledge of a language specified in the Eighth Schedule of the Constitution, with her more than adequate working knowledge of Hindi. Sonia Gandhi was enrolled as a voter in 1980 in the New Delhi Lok Sabha constituency - three years before she acquired Indian citizenship - and following an expose in the media, her name was deleted from the electoral rolls in 1982. She exercised her r ights as a voter after acquiring Indian citizenship in 1983. The Congress(I) has stated that she did not exercise her franchise before 1983, although her name appeared in the voters list between 1980 and 1982. Had there been any evidence of her voting be tween 1980 and 1982, she could have been prosecuted for making a false statement in Form 6 - the application for seeking voting rights - that she was a citizen of India, as only citizens can exercise the franchise. Media reports during the 1980 general e lections suggest that only Indira Gandhi and Rajiv Gandhi voted in the Nehru-Gandhi household. It would be absurd to suggest that Sonia Gandhi sought to be included in the voters' list in order to secure her Indian citizenship, as being a voter is not a condition for determining whether a person is a citizen. Is it the case that India's Constitution-framers reckoned only with natural-born citizens, and did not think of a "naturalisation" process for foreign-born persons to acquire Indian citizenship? Articles 5 to 11 in Part II of the Constitution deal with the subject of citizenship. Article 5 deals with citizenship at the commencement of the Constitution. It confers citizenship on every person who has his or her domicile in the territory of India and "(a) who was born in the territory of India; or (b) eit her of whose parents was born in the territory of India; or (c) who has been ordinarily resident in the territory of India for not less than five years preceding such commencement." Article 11 empowers Parliament to make any provision with respect to the acquisition and termination of citizenship and all other matters relating to citizenship. This was achieved by the Citizenship Act, enacted by Parliament in 1955. Clearly, the objective of the Constitution-makers - as evident from the August 1949 debates on the issue of citizenship in the Constituent Assembly - was not exclusivist. They were concerned with prescribing general qualifications for citizenship and lef t it to Parliament to decide the position of persons who are not born Indians. They agreed that there would be the law of naturalisation which would make detailed provisions relating to persons who are not born of Indian parents. It is to the credit of the Indian Constitution that it does not distinguish the rights of citizens on the basis of how they acquired citizenship - by birth, descent, registration, naturalisation or incorporation of territory. It does not create different classes or categories of citizens. Vitally, unlike its United States counterpart, the Indian Constitution does not restrict eligibility to the top constitutional offices of President and Vice-President to natural-born citizens. There is also no question of placing any such restriction on eligibility to become a Minister or Prime Minister or Chief Minister. It was certainly a conscious decision of the Constitution-makers, as any such distinction between natural-born and naturalised citizens would milita te against equality before the law ensured by the Constitution."     sidney Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/21/04 at 05:27:48 »    Yes, India is shinning in some way, not necessary in financial strength. Spiritual, of course. What's happening in the open society like in India  is a good lesson the world will ever learn. Simple living and thinking high - such example you may not find in the high society like western hemishpere. How filthy and poor India may be, the people are still walking and smiling. Long live India!!!  Please don't listen to anyone but to your own conscience.     Amitav Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/21/04 at 14:27:12 »    Hi Sakuntala, it seems that when I refffered to Sonai  as a receptionist(or maid servant) I didnt release that if someone like you visiting silchar.com might be doing the same profession and will get hurt. I forgot that some of the Bangadeshis(living in UK) working in low category jobs (like you) visit silchar.com during their spare time. So I am extremely sorry to have hurt your feelings, but you are also to be blamed because I attacked the Job which  Sonia  was doing in UK(maid servant)  and you have taken it personally because you are also a rag picker or maid servant. That is not fair.     Dr Baharul Islam Guest Got to see your point   «on: 05/25/04 at 18:58:42 »    Dear Stranger Sandy, Your points well taken! I am more happy now that Mrs Gandhi has averted that unnecessary missiles that which she would have faced from opposition just for not being of Indian origin. It saved her party a lot of energy for some other constructive jobs. Dr Singh is a well qualified person and moreover, Assam will have its representative as the PM. Its long ago we had a top post like that of President/PM from this state. Its thanks to Mrs Gandhi again, otherwise we may never have a chance to get a Rai Barreli (?) or Amethi nearer to our homes! On the home front, we should now regularly write to Sri S M Dev to do something (employment generative) for Silchar as he has got a very conducive Ministry for such initiative. In fact I wrote to him personally yesterday and I will sure make it a point again when I visit India soon as UN representative on official mission. Again, long after Mainul Haq Chaudhury we got a full-fledged Industry Minister in Barak valley. Lets keep ourselves in touch on this to appeal to our Hon. MP from time to time in this regard. I was in Silchar after a long gap in Mar/04. I am pained to see the stagnancy in my home town and increased number of jobless youths on the streets. Baharul Islam     another silcharian Guest Re: India Shining!!!!!!!!!!!! Give ur Comments....   «on: 05/26/04 at 19:14:19 »    As far as doing something for the Barak valley is concerned,I think we should push to help improve the long term ground conditions in Silchar like improved co-operation from Govt. officials to opening of private sector units,improved roads and Telecommunications,air link ,gauge conversion of Lumding to Silchar,opening of trade routes with ASEAN countries through Manipur . doing such things is much better than providing few token jobs in SAIL and other companies for some Barak Valley youths .